Lunar Champ A511 Water Drain

[GeoffPunnett]

I'm new to motorhoming and have just bought a 2009 Lunar Champ A511. Can anyone advise me as to the correct procedure to drain down the fresh water. The 'handbook' with the van is next to useless and talks about a drain valve iunder one of the dinette seats; my van does not have this drain valve, and has the fresh water tank between the floor.

[colin]

It may be that your van has two (or more) valves, one might be on or near the tank, but the one near dinette might well be a Truma dump valve or similar. These are normaly near the boiler.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRUMA-BOILER-FROSTCONTROL-FOR-MOTORHOME-BOAT-CARAVAN-PART-NO-34020-80200-/161120149994?_trksid=p2054897.l4276

[lancepar]

Welcome.

 

I would also expect there would be two clean water drains as well as a drain for the waste water tank.

Not same as yours but on our M/H there is a drain near the heater accessed from inside and a drain for the fresh water tank outside.

Our manual says to drain off the water(s) with the taps open then run the pump for about 30 secs.

Do you not have a user manual?

 

B-)

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks. I seem to remember that the Company I bought from did advise that I need to depress the 'dump valve' on the Truma boiler to drain the fresh water.

[colin]

BTW the fresh water tank on our van is emptied from inside the tank, probably the worst bit of design on our van changed on later versions, we have to unscrew an access cover from top of tank then reach to bottom of tank and release an expanding bung.

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks.

I do have a 'dump valve' on the Truma boiler but can't find another valve on the fresh water tank.

I do have a manual but it's not correct for my model; the manual describes a fresh water tank in one of the seat bases with a drain valve but my fresh water tank is between the floors. I have a hatch in the floor with a screw cover on the fresh water tank but no drain valve.

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks.

Like you I have a screwed cover under a hatch in the floor, but I can't unscrew the cover. I'll have another go at unscrewing the cover tomorrow.

[colin]

GeoffPunnett - 2014-03-13 9:15 PM

 

Thanks. I seem to remember that the Company I bought from did advise that I need to depress the 'dump valve' on the Truma boiler to drain the fresh water.

 

If your dump valve is like the one in link, turning 'tap' on top will release the water, at the same time a blue button will pop out, before refilling you need to press this button back in. The button will also pop out if the temperature drops to low, this is to protect boiler from freezing. On some vans these valves are a complete PIA to access, on one van we hired you could only just see valve by lying on the floor and looking throu a 4" square hole, to operate valve you had to blindly reach in the hole and work it by touch.

[Derek Uzzell]

GeoffPunnett - 2014-03-13 9:27 PM

 

Thanks.

Like you I have a screwed cover under a hatch in the floor, but I can't unscrew the cover. I'll have another go at unscrewing the cover tomorrow.

 

There is a reference on another motorhome forum to draining the fresh-water tank of a Lunar Champ (though not the A511 model). The expression "pulled the plug" is used, so it's quite likely that the drain for your tank is accessed through the tank's access cover as Colin describes. (It's a fairly common way of doing it.)

 

Unscrewing the access cover can prove difficult if it hasn't been recently removed. If it's really stuck, you may need to DIY a tool to do it. Mine is a made from a piece of thickish plywood shaped like a small table-tennis bat, with a number of short 'dowels' that go through the plywood and match the spacing of the indentations in the access cover. I place the tool flat on the top of the access cover with the dowels engaged in the cover's indentations and pull on the tool's 'handle'. This provided a lot of leverage but, if the cover still refuses to budge, a tap on the tool's 'handle' with a hammer is always effective.

 

A 2009 Champ will have a Truma "Combi" combination air/water heater and its drain-valve will normally be as Colin advises. If your Lunar handbook is uninformative, you should be able to download manufacturers' instructions for your fridge and heater. Truma's "Combi" Installation/Operating instructions can be found here

 

http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/gb/combi/combi_gas.html

 

Draining down a motorhome's water system to protect successfully against frost damage (which may have been the reason for your inquiry) requires some care. There's a good deal of earlier forum discussion about this issue. This is an example

 

http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Hints-and-Tips/Winter-draws-on-draining-water-from-tanks-and-pipework/29115/

 

 

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks everyone. I managed, at last, to undo the very large blue screw cover under the floor of my Lunar Champ. That gives me access to a very shallow section at the top of the fresh water tank and there's a hinged 'tee' piece/handle that can be moved up and down and, I assume, raises and lowers a 'bung' in the bottom of the tank. I'll have a go next week filling the tank and seeing which way the handle has to be moved to open/close the 'bung'. I'll report back as it may be useful for any other 'newbies' out there.

[colin]

I suspect the tee piece handle is like ours, push it down and it expands the bung to lock it, lift it up and pull and the bunk pulls out.

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks Colin for the advice. From what you said about 'a bung' and a 'tee piece' I plucked up the courage and pulled as hard as I could and the 'bung' came out of the hole. My problem now is how to get the 'bung' back in, as the hole is offset from the access cover and you can't get the 'bung' in with the 'tee piece' arm straight up. I'll keep trying.

[donbarry]

We have a 2007 Lunar Champ A511 which we have had 18 months and had the same problem with the fresh water drainage. The bung kept coming out and disappearing out of view in the tank. In the end we had a tap fitted which we access underneath but we also drain the water in the boiler by lifting the lever to the upright position. We agree the handbook is absolutely useless!

P.S. If you know what the tyre pressures should be please let me know!

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks Don. I'd be interested to know how the tank was accessed to fit a tap as I can't see that pulling the 'plug' in the tank can possibly drain all the water.

I have a label on the return of the passenger door that says that for tyres 215/70 - R15 the pressures should be:

5 bar front

5.5 bar rear

Though the Lunar Champ 'Manual' states, confusingly,

5 bar front

5 bar rear

for Michelin Camping

and

4.1 bar front

4.5 bar rear

for 'Michelin/Others' without the 'Camping' 'Tyre Type' designation.

So I'm as confused as you are.

[Brian Kirby]

First verify what type and size of tyre is fitted. "Camping" tyres will carry the designation CP. (The one exception I am aware of is made by Continental in 16" diameter only, and is designated C, so should not add to your present confusion.) There are only three ranges of tyres with CP designation: Michelin Agilis Camping, Continental VancoCamper, and Pirelli Chrono Camper. The latter are relatively rare, so you are effectively down to Michelin or Continental.

 

The pressures given on the door label are Fiat's standard recommendation. As you say the Lunar manual appears not to relate to your van, its tyre pressure recommendation probably doesn't relate either, so should be disregarded.

 

If all tyres are CP type, use the Fiat pressures for now and see if you find the ride acceptable. If the tyres are not CP type, but bear only the C designation, use the lower recommended pressures and ditto.

 

If you find the ride unacceptably harsh in either case it may be possible to run at lower pressures, but you would need first to take your fully laden van to a weighbridge (a good idea in any case) and check not just the actual laden weight of the van, but also the weight on each axle.

 

Fiat's pressures are based on the maximum permissible load for each axle - which for most vans is impossible to achieve at both axles while remaining within the permissible MAM (although rear axles are often close). This is a "fail safe" position, because Fiat cannot know how much any given owner will carry, or how that load will be distributed within the van.

 

The usual result is over-inflation relative to load, leading to the hard ride etc, but it avoids the dangers of under-inflation. When you know how much weight each axle is carrying it is possible to select the optimum tyre pressure for that load. This usually results in a better ride, some improvement to directional stability, and better distributed wear.

[GeoffPunnett]

Thanks Brian.

I've been in touch with Continental and, using the figures in my Lunar Champ Manual, I told Continental that the max. axle loadings are stated as 1900kg.

Continental have responded with a recommendation that 4.5bar all round is suitable for Continental Vanco Camper 215/70 - 15 CP 109R tyres; though I'm running on 4.5 front/4.9 rear, as set when I collected the M/H from the dealer.

 

Geoff

[Keithl]

Geoff,

 

There is a very simple explanation why the dealer has set your rear tyres at 4.90 bar, it is the pressure for rear tyres when the vehicle is rear wheel drive!

If the vehicle is front wheel drive then the pressures will be the same for the same max axle loading.

 

Have a look on the Motorhome Tyres brochure which you can download from here... Link and on the lower half of the last page you will find recommended inflation pressures versus axle loading for different CP tyre sizes. Against your size you will see 'Single Wheel' and 'Single Rear (1)' where Note (1) then says 'Driven Wheels Only'.

 

I hope this answers your dilemma!

 

PS You can also find pressure versus loading figures on the Continental tyres website but it takes a lot more finding and every set of figures I have compared to Tyresafe match!

 

Keith.

[Derek Uzzell]

Although the TyreSafe document mentions "Driven wheels only" pressures for 'camping-car' tyres ftted to a motorhome's rear-axle, Continental's technical handbook does not make that distinction.

 

For a Continental 215/70 R15CP tyre (ie, a VancoCamper) the handbook's advice for a 1900kg axle-loading would be about 4.35bar for a front-axle and 4.95bar for a rear-axle irrespective of whether the latter is 'driven' or 'dead'.

 

In Geoff's case I'd want to confirm his Champ's maximum authorised axle-loads from the motorhome's VIN-plate and not rely on the accuracy of the Lunar manual. (1900kg front and rear axle may well be correct, but it's more usual for the rear axle loading figure to be higher than the front axle figure.)

 

It's very likely that the 'real world' axle loadings of Geoff's motorhome (ie. when Geoff is operating the vehicle) differ from the maximum loadings shown on the VIN-plate, but the only way to know if that's so would be to have the vehicle weighed in normally-loaded condition.