derek pringle Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hi All, I wonder if anybody may be able to help me please. When on sites where 2 mains leads have to be connected due to the distance from the supply, we have found this mainly in France, it results in the connection being exposed to the weather- sometimes just laying on the ground in all conditions. I know I have seen a pod like container which houses the joint and protects it from the weather. In fact I bought what I thought was the correct item whilst in Holland but found it to be too small for uk mains connectors. I can not for the life of me remember where I saw the said item but am sure it was at one of the Motorhome shows. I have scoured the net. but with no luck--please can anybody help me as we are off again shortly and would like to take it in our kit just in case. Many thanks in advance. derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hi Derek Try Machine Mart they do a Safe Box part no 010810440 it says ok for camping etc and protection from damp Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted July 16, 2011 Author Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hi Alf, Will do and I will post if they are the same as I am looking for cheers for the input derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted July 16, 2011 Author Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hi again Alf, Checked and it seems just the job, thanks very much. One has now been ordered and on its way. I was blinkered looking at camping accessory outlets but no luck. Thanks again for your help derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_C Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hmm. That 'protector' is only IP44 which is the same rating as the standard hook up lead plug and socket, so I'm not sure what additional protection it provides. Except that an IP44 connection inside another IP44 connection might possibly be a bit safer? What's really needed is the IP67 plug and socket fitted instead of the standard IP44 ones. Like this: http://www.screwfix.com/p/200-250v-mk-commando-interlocked-straight-plug-2p-e-ip67/77879 and http://www.screwfix.com/p/200-250v-mk-commando-interlocked-straight-plug-2p-e-ip67/69573 Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Andy_C - 2011-07-16 3:27 PM Hmm. That 'protector' is only IP44 which is the same rating as the standard hook up lead plug and socket, so I'm not sure what additional protection it provides. Except that an IP44 connection inside another IP44 connection might possibly be a bit safer? What's really needed is the IP67 plug and socket fitted instead of the standard IP44 ones. Like this: http://www.screwfix.com/p/200-250v-mk-commando-interlocked-straight-plug-2p-e-ip67/77879 and http://www.screwfix.com/p/200-250v-mk-commando-interlocked-straight-plug-2p-e-ip67/69573 Andy I agree. You only need one of each, the plug (male) at the end of your mains lead in lieu of its IP44 plug, and the socket (female) at the end of the extension cable in lieu of its IP44 socket. These items will still connect to CEE site feeders, or to IP44 line connectors. The only connection that may not work, is the IP67 (female) socket into the motorhome mains connection socket (which is actually a (male) plug). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JENIAN Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Hi Derek, I have a pod connector that is waterproof, made by 'JO-EL' here is their website:- http://www.jo-el.co.uk/. Kind regards Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 No mention of it on their website! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Brian Kirby - 2011-07-16 6:15 PM No mention of it on their website! Brian you need to look here this looks a bit better than the Machine Mart one but whilst I do feel the need to use one myself I can see that it may make others feel better using one and it would certainly help in rain http://www.jojo.co.uk/catalogue/Nov_2006_FINAL_JoJo_Product_Catalogue_R1.pdf the item to look for is no 917000 Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 JENIAN - 2011-07-16 5:21 PM Hi Derek, I have a pod connector that is waterproof, made by 'JO-EL' here is their website:- http://www.jo-el.co.uk/. Kind regards Ian Hi Ian I visited a caravan accessories shop yesterday looking for that very same item - but without any success! Is the Jo-el large enough to take both plug and cosket of two leads joined together? If so I will try to obtain one. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Dwight Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 Bought one last week at Go Outdoors. I have been looking for one for several years, I saw one in France many years ago, just like the UK to be years behind, I bet it was an Englishman who designed the first one!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Losos Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 David Dwight - 2011-07-16 10:17 PM Bought one last week at Go Outdoors. I have been looking for one for several years, I saw one in France many years ago, just like the UK to be years behind, I bet it was an Englishman who designed the first one!!!! This type of connector has been available for decades in UK from suppliers such as RS Componants and Farnell - the problem has been that your typical camping accessory supplier hasn't had the incentive to go looking for them. Not sure if an Englishman can claim to be the first to design one, it was more likely an American but Bulgin plc is a well known British manufacturer of military connectors which of course have to have a high IP rating, incidentally for motorhome use IP55 is probably more than adequate, IP77 is only for use on offshore oil platforms etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 To ascertain which covers are most suitable you need to understand the IEC Ingress Protection (IP) rating 1st digit relates to ingress of hameful solid foreign objects. 2nd digit relates to ingress of water. Generally the Plugs & Sockets on Hook-up Cables are rated IP44 (taken from the IEC website) 1st digit 4 - less than 1mm. 5 - dust protected ingress of dust is not entirely prevented, but it must not enter in sufficient quantity to interfere with the satisfactory operation of the equipment; complete protection against contact . 6 - dust tight no ingress of dust; complete protection against contact. 2nd digit 4 -splashing water Water splashing against the enclosure from any direction shall have no harmful effect. 5 - water jets Water projected by a nozzle against enclosure from any direction shall have no harmful effects. 6 - powerful water jets Water projected in powerful jets against the enclosure from any direction shall have no harmful effects. 7 - immersion up to 1 m Ingress of water in harmful quantity shall not be possible when the enclosure is immersed in water under defined conditions of pressure and time (up to 1 m of submersion). So ideally IP57 or IP55 would be the most satisfactory rating for hook-up cables, however these are not made in a wide range of fittings & industry would normally upgrade to IP67. Regarding “Losos” comment, I very much doubt they originated in the USA as they have a different NEMA rating system, where NEMA 4 & 4X = IP56 NEMA 12 = IP52 NEMA 13 = IP54 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Hi AndyC, I already have the shop bought leads with connectors, this 'pod' for the want of a better word is purely a waterproof holder that contains the connected joint, just wished to keep water away when in this situation. If starting from scratch would maybe go for the connections in Brians post, bear in mind he says there is a possible hiccup in that method. thanks for your help derek David, cheers for this but could not find on Go Outdoors website last week. derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dikyenfo Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Surely the way to go is no interconnection between one end and the other and 50/100 metres on a roller that can be easily tucked into a gas locker is much the better alternative. Kids play around with stuff on the ground and long extensions with bits interposed is pas bon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 A potential problem with the standard 'rugby ball'-type protective cover is that it's designed to accept a domestic plug & socket (this is the case with the 91700 product alf mentions). However, such covers aren't large enough to accept the CEE-type plug & socket used on most camping hook-up cables. There is a cover available for CEE-type connectors, but I don't know if you can get it in the UK. The two types (standard and larger) are shown at the bottom of this French webpage: http://www.accessoire-attelage-remorque.fr/category.php?id_category=11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Derek Uzzell - 2011-07-17 9:17 AM A potential problem with the standard 'rugby ball'-type protective cover is that it's designed to accept a domestic plug & socket (this is the case with the 91700 product alf mentions). However, such covers aren't large enough to accept the CEE-type plug & socket used on most camping hook-up cables. There is a cover available for CEE-type connectors, but I don't know if you can get it in the UK. The two types (standard and larger) are shown at the bottom of this French webpage: http://www.accessoire-attelage-remorque.fr/category.php?id_category=11 Thank you Derek. Jenian seems to be using the Jo-el type (see post above) but are you saying it is unlikely that it will be large enough to take the joined standard CEE type connectors? David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_C Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Derek Uzzell - 2011-07-17 9:17 AM A potential problem with the standard 'rugby ball'-type protective cover is that it's designed to accept a domestic plug & socket (this is the case with the 91700 product alf mentions). However, such covers aren't large enough to accept the CEE-type plug & socket used on most camping hook-up cables. There is a cover available for CEE-type connectors, but I don't know if you can get it in the UK. The two types (standard and larger) are shown at the bottom of this French webpage: http://www.accessoire-attelage-remorque.fr/category.php?id_category=11 Sadly no IP ratings are given. The standard one doesn't look at all waterproof, the larger (PROTEGE PRISE SPECIAL P17) looks better. If it was possible to find the manufacturer's details they might quote IP rating. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Hi. Cheap alternative. If you only want to protect the connector from the rain, you could do what I did. I used a plastric container that came with mushrooms from Aldi (any suitable size container would do),this was just the right length, height, and width to contain the connectors. I cut slits up the ends,terminating in little round holes to accommodate the cables.Just slide the cables up the slits and into the holes. When upside down, this holds the connectors off the ground and are protected from the rain by the container.My container was blue in colour. I stuck strips of yellow reflective tape over it to make it more noticable. Brian B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Sorry could not attach photo's. *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alf Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 It seem that the Machine Mart Brennenstuhl IP44 BIG Safe Box is only for a 13a plug and socket not a 16a plug and socket http://www.brennenstuhl.com/ibase/download.php?filename=%2Fhome%2Fimportxml%2Fonline%2Fibase%2Fmodule%2Fmedienarchiv%2Fdateien%2Finfobox%2FKatalog_BS1011.pdf so it looks like the French one, Go Outdoors or the Aldi Special buys one Alf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JENIAN Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Derek Uzzell - 2011-07-17 9:17 AM A potential problem with the standard 'rugby ball'-type protective cover is that it's designed to accept a domestic plug & socket (this is the case with the 91700 product alf mentions). However, such covers aren't large enough to accept the CEE-type plug & socket used on most camping hook-up cables. There is a cover available for CEE-type connectors, but I don't know if you can get it in the UK. The two types (standard and larger) are shown at the bottom of this French webpage: http://www.accessoire-attelage-remorque.fr/category.php?id_category=11 This looks alot better than my pod by JO-EL Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Hi Derek, The Protege prise special you indicate is the type of thing I am after but when I bought 1 in Holland [dont know if French would be the same], it was too small to hold the uk connectors. As I say I have seen them in the UK but just cant recall where, they were blue by the way. Seen a guy in Germany seperating 2 leads and the corrosion was bad. In th UK and many sites abroad a single length does-I carry 1 x lead at 15mtr and 1 x lead at 25mtr but now and then I have needed to maximize. Just trying to be safe rather than sorry ,cos any water in there could cause other problems than merely corrosion of connectors I assume. cheers derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 The German job claims only IP44 (but I'm personally dubious this can always be achieved), which is only the same rating as the standard CEE plug/socket you wish to improve on. IP44 is splash proof. Sitting in a puddle, neither, individually or in combination, would remain dry internally. In heavy rain, lying on the ground, the exposure conditions exceed IP44. It is no longer being splashed, it is virtually immersed. The JoJo job makes no claim at all, so is presumably untested, with unknown performance. A plastic bag tied round a CEE IP44 plug/socket would probably be as (in)effective, and a lot cheaper. You pays your money! :-D If you want reasonable all weather safety for an in-line connection using CEE connectors the answer has already been provided. Buy the IP67 version which, as flicka has shown, can safely be immersed in up to 1 meter of water and remain dry internally. (Personally, I'd hope to have left the site before the water got that deep, but if I couldn't, I don't think a dry electrical connection would be my greatest worry! :-)) I think you're kidding yourselves. :-) If it is dry when you arrive, and you have to join cables to reach the pillar, and you then get a thunderstorm overnight, how can you possibly know where the puddles will form? Granted, it is always preferable to raise the connector above ground level, whatever type it is. However, it is not always possible to do so, so safety with IP44 connectors is not a foregone conclusion. If you want to improve on IP44, you do need to go up to IP67, because that the next level up that is available. If you are happy to live with IP44, then stay with that. What's the problem with that? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 The following link provides more information on the two types of protective cover I mentioned earlier: http://www.accessoire-remorque.fr/categorie.php?fam_id=171 If you click on the "Plus de details" button for each product, you'll see the difference in size and you can obtain enlarged pictures by subsequently clicking on the "Agrandir la photo" button. For what it's worth, there appear to be design differences between the smaller covers being displayed on-line, with some having edge-seals and others not. These covers are marketed to protect against water 'splashing' and one advert specifically warns "NE PAS PLONGER DANS L'EAU" (DO NOT IMMERSE IN WATER). So, if your objective is to fully waterproof your EHU cable joint, these covers won't do it. If you just want to protect the joint against fellow-campers' dogs piddling on it, or (if you use the version with a locking capability) to stop the joint being separated accidentally or deliberately, then they should be usefully OK. If a fully waterproof cable joint is required, then (as Brian advises) the logical approach would be to use connectors to IP67 standard. In practice, this may not be as straightforward as it initially seems. I carry two hook-up cables - a 10m and a 25m. On the rare occasions I use an EHU I prefer to use the 10m cable as it's stored handily in my Hobby's gas-locker and is more manageable than the 25m. If the 10m cable proves too short, then I use the 25m cable instead. I've never needed to connect the cables together, but it's obvious that I could reach 35m if I did. It's very unlikely that I'll ever need to connect my 10m and 25m cables together, so the connectors fitted at both ends are the original common-or-garden P17 splash-resistant IP44 type. The Hobby's 230v mains inlet socket is designed to accept the type of standardised IP44 plug fitted to both my EHU cables, but I'm far from sure that it would accept a bulkier IP67 plug. What I'm suggesting is that, while there would be no difficulty linking EHU cables using IP67 connectors, the extra bulk of IP67 connectors MIGHT cause practical problems if the cables were to be used independently. These are examples of 'P17' connectors to IP67 and you'll see what I mean: http://www.electro-mpo.ru/en/card9794.html http://www.electro-mpo.ru/en/card11907.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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